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Author Topic: I think I get it now  (Read 2718 times)
LambertsFrontTeeth
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« Reply #10 on: Jan 09, 2008 at 05:05 »

Ok, so to me the case boils down to this:

Arians Pros

- QB excelled after troubling previous season
- Offense consistently able to "come back" when down
- RB led league in rush (prior to injury) with lousy O-line
- Put up points, if inconsistently, with a consistently bad O-line


Arians Cons

- Offense consistently couldn't protect QB
- Too many late developing passing plays (see above)
- Too many ineffective cutesy trick plays
- Inability to protect a lead by keeping the chains moving
- Inconsistent/ineffective play calling (in most of our opinions)
- Failure to institute (as promised) more no- huddle (that's a personal gripe)

Some of those "cons" are institutional...if you have Mahan as your center, and
shitty play all over your line, you can't expect to get great pass protection or use power running to control the clock. However, you also shouldn't stubbornly continue to run up the gut, or call 7 step drop pass plays on 2nd and 13.

Still, I think Arians should stay, as it was his first year as OC (with us). He was inconsistent, but not terrible (in my opinion). I don't want to have to change OC again, I want Ben to get another year to work with someone he is clearly comfortable with. If Arians doesn't grow and improve (as one should expect), then we can part ways later.

Arians might not have been great, but his offense was NOT a failure. That's more than we call all say for our special teams.
 
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pensodyssey
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« Reply #11 on: Jan 11, 2008 at 22:38 »

I still want Arians to be fired, and I want aj to change his avatar to a new girl,  because I'm bored with WR screens and the same girl's ass all the time, respectively.

SING CARLY BATSCH!!!!!!!!!11
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aj_law
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« Reply #12 on: Jan 12, 2008 at 13:08 »

Quote
I still want Arians to be fired, and I want aj to change his avatar to a new girl,  because I'm bored with WR screens and the same girl's ass all the time, respectively.

 
"And so it was written..."
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DoctorJohnnyFever
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« Reply #13 on: Jan 12, 2008 at 13:11 »

I didn't like the play call, but what I dislike even more than the play call is this mindset:


Quote
Arians' fucking horseshit playcalling cost them the playoffs.


Wrong. Wrong. Wrong.

What cost the Steelers the playoffs was four turnovers and allowing more big plays than they made.

 
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PittsburghPA
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« Reply #14 on: Jan 13, 2008 at 03:44 »

Quote
I didn't like the play call, but what I dislike even more than the play call is this mindset:


Quote
Arians' fucking horseshit playcalling cost them the playoffs.


Wrong. Wrong. Wrong.

What cost the Steelers the playoffs was four turnovers and allowing more big plays than they made.
I thought what cost the Steelers the playoffs was allowing their opponent to score more points than they did? :ph43r:

But seriously...now that I've cooled off, I can see why keeping Bruce Arians around might be beneficial: continuity on offense makes it better, and people are capable of learning from their mistakes. Hell, even stubborn-ass Bill Cowher learned after 13 seasons that he should trust his coordinators more in the playoffs. He got a ring as a result. If Cowher, of all people, can learn from his mistakes, then why not Arians?

I understand Mike Tomlin's approach. If you'll notice, he's talked a lot about making changes to the roster, but does not plan to change any members of his coaching staff right away. That's how Bill Parcells and other successful head coaches have done it: the staff gets more benefit of the doubt than the players do. That's really how it should be for us, especially considering this team is only a shell of its Super Bowl XL self. If the players change and the system still doesn't work as well as it should, then you examine the coaches -- but only then.

Now that Tomlin has been with the team for a full season, he has a better idea of who's worth keeping and who's not. For one thing, I believe that all the ardent Cowher disciples need to be shown the door, regardless. The last thing we need is dissent among the ranks. Bill Belichick doesn't take any shit from players who question his system (see: Malloy, Lawyer), and neither should Tomlin. THE PITTSBURGH STEELERS ARE MIKE TOMLIN'S GODDAMN TEAM NOW! I believe Tomlin will exert much greater control over the team this off-season, and I wouldn't be surprised to see a major roster purge. (Didn't Cowher get to dispose of Chuck Noll's trash pretty quick?)
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pensodyssey
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« Reply #15 on: Jan 13, 2008 at 04:12 »

Quote

But seriously...now that I've cooled off, I can see why keeping Bruce Arians around might be beneficial: continuity on offense makes it better, and people are capable of learning from their mistakes. Hell, even stubborn-ass Bill Cowher learned after 13 seasons that he should trust his coordinators more in the playoffs. He got a ring as a result. If Cowher, of all people, can learn from his mistakes, then why not Arians?
 
I'd love to agree with you pitt pa, but Arians has been a dumb ass for years; as padg pointed put a month or two back, he's been trying the same shit since Cleveland.
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aj_law
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« Reply #16 on: Jan 14, 2008 at 12:38 »

Quote
I didn't like the play call, but what I dislike even more than the play call is this mindset:


Quote
Arians' fucking horseshit playcalling cost them the playoffs.


Wrong. Wrong. Wrong.

What cost the Steelers the playoffs was four turnovers and allowing more big plays than they made.
Well, to be fair Dr. J, in retrospect, I don't think you can attribute this loss to one, single factor.  

Everything played a part in it; turnovers, horseshit playcalling from the mid first quarter to the 4th quarter; the decision to go for 2 from the 12; defense not getting it done when necessary.  

They all played a role.

Some people feel the turnovers were the main culprit while others believe the playcalling, the defense or Tomlin should share the majority of the blame.

You think it was the turnovers.  I think it was Arians.  Neither of us is wrong and we're both right.

Despite what several have said in defense of Arians, I still think it should've cost him his job though.
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steelerfaninCO
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« Reply #17 on: Jan 14, 2008 at 14:37 »

Quote
Ok, so to me the case boils down to this:

Arians Pros

- QB excelled after troubling previous season
- Offense consistently able to "come back" when down
- RB led league in rush (prior to injury) with lousy O-line
- Put up points, if inconsistently, with a consistently bad O-line


Arians Cons

- Offense consistently couldn't protect QB
- Too many late developing passing plays (see above)
- Too many ineffective cutesy trick plays
- Inability to protect a lead by keeping the chains moving
- Inconsistent/ineffective play calling (in most of our opinions)
- Failure to institute (as promised) more no- huddle (that's a personal gripe)

Some of those "cons" are institutional...if you have Mahan as your center, and
shitty play all over your line, you can't expect to get great pass protection or use power running to control the clock. However, you also shouldn't stubbornly continue to run up the gut, or call 7 step drop pass plays on 2nd and 13.

Still, I think Arians should stay, as it was his first year as OC (with us). He was inconsistent, but not terrible (in my opinion). I don't want to have to change OC again, I want Ben to get another year to work with someone he is clearly comfortable with. If Arians doesn't grow and improve (as one should expect), then we can part ways later.

Arians might not have been great, but his offense was NOT a failure. That's more than we call all say for our special teams.
I would add to the Arians cons the lack of consistent RZ scoring. The team kicked a lot of short FG's this year and much of it was due to poor RZ playcalling. Like middle screens, WR screens, fades, and WR(the slow one) sweeps on 4th down. Also he doesn't seem to shine when the game is on the line, at least not this year.

The reality is he will be back. A better OL definately helps him, but who's to say that the OL will actually be better next year? Fortuantely the bar has been set pretty low and just replacing Mahan makes them better. BR did light it up this year and Willie was also leading the league in attempts as well as yards so something was going right. He, statistically at least, didn't abandon the run game and Ben made the most of his oppotunites. I hope BA does get better and the OL can protect BR long enough for those 15 yard patterns he likes to run, but I still wonder if he is going to be able to dial up the right play at  crucial times. I hope so.
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leighclay
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« Reply #18 on: Jan 14, 2008 at 20:18 »

Quote
Quote from: DoctorJohnnyFever,Jan 12 2008, 02:11 PM
I didn't like the play call, but what I dislike even more than the play call is this mindset:


Quote
Arians' fucking horseshit playcalling cost them the playoffs.


Wrong. Wrong. Wrong.


Now that Tomlin has been with the team for a full season, he has a better idea of who's worth keeping and who's not. For one thing, I believe that all the ardent Cowher disciples need to be shown the door, regardless. The last thing we need is dissent among the ranks. Bill Belichick doesn't take any shit from players who question his system (see: Malloy, Lawyer), and neither should Tomlin. THE PITTSBURGH STEELERS ARE MIKE TOMLIN'S GODDAMN TEAM NOW! I believe Tomlin will exert much greater control over the team this off-season, and I wouldn't be surprised to see a major roster purge. (Didn't Cowher get to dispose of Chuck Noll's trash pretty quick?)
Amen brother.
And Amen to Finny's posts.

At the end of the day, would you have been happier losing to the Pats?
I wouldn't have.
I'd much rather lost to J'ville and bring the pain to the Pats next season.

But that's just me.

Still not sure I'm crazy about Arians, but I'm willing to give him a draft and some time.

Seriously....are you guys that pissed off about this season?
I had my ups and downs, but overall, this season just made me really excited for next season...

 :tits:  :tits:  :tits:  
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