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Author Topic: Pens trade for Garon  (Read 1498 times)
PghSteel-43
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« on: Jan 17, 2009 at 10:54 »

http://penguins.nhl.com/team/app/?se...ticleid=404781
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Merman1983
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« Reply #1 on: Jan 17, 2009 at 11:51 »

Seriously, what the fuck? Shero just made Fluery a very rich man last offseason, and now he trades for a back-up goalie, and a bad one at that.

This after giving Jordal Staal the extension he didn't deserve. And signing a lazy slug to replace Hossa.

I used to have alot of faith in Shero.
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PghSteel-43
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« Reply #2 on: Jan 17, 2009 at 12:45 »

While it doesn't come close to solving our problems, I'll take it considering that Sabourin has looked like hell and Ryan Stone hasn't done jack when given the opportunity.

Plus, I recall Stone not being happy in the Penguins organization. I believe he was the one who refused his WBS assignment in the beginning of the season and then changed his mind. I could be wrong on that, but I'm fairly sure.

Eitherway, I'll take Garon. The same guy who replaced Roloson last season and was only replaced later in the year by Roloson because of an ankle injury.

He's also pretty damn good when it comes to shootouts. He was 10-0 last season in SO's, led the league. So while he may not be having the greatest year this season, he was pretty damn good last season.

Plus, it's not like we are banking on this guy to be our long term #2. That's why we have Curry. At least we got something for a shaky Sabourin and a underachieving and unhappy Ryan Stone. Who knows? Maybe Garon pushes Fleury to play better? It didn't hurt last season with Conklin and his numbers were not exactly stellar before he came to Pittsburgh.

At $1.2 million and really not giving up all that much, I'll take it.
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whitmer_87
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« Reply #3 on: Jan 17, 2009 at 12:55 »

Also, Sabourin's contract is up after this season, and he wasn't going to sign with us. At least we got something for him I guess. I'll take Garon, I agree PghSteel43 too. Might help bring MAF's game back up to where it was in the playoffs last year.
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PghSteel-43
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« Reply #4 on: Jan 17, 2009 at 13:46 »

Also, Sabourin's contract is up after this season, and he wasn't going to sign with us. At least we got something for him I guess. I'll take Garon, I agree PghSteel43 too. Might help bring MAF's game back up to where it was in the playoffs last year.

Last night he was one of the three stars of the game.  He made 37 saves in a 3-2 win against the Avs.  Not bad for a guy who played on a team that was rotating three different goaltenders this year.

Like I said, it's not going to solve all of our problems, but at least we got something in return for Sabourin and Stone.  Also, they were interviewing Fletcher a little while ago on the radio and while he did not come out and say it, they are not happy with Fleury right now.  I believe this is also a strong message sent to Fleury.
« Last Edit: Jan 17, 2009 at 13:57 by PghSteel-43 » Logged
PghSteel-43
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« Reply #5 on: Jan 17, 2009 at 15:18 »

They are already talking about either sending him down to Springfield or trading him....

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It is expected Sabourin, 28, will either be assigned to the Oilers AHL affiliate in Springfield or moved to another NHL team within the next couple of days.
 

http://www.edmontonsun.com/Sports/Oi...7/8057836.html

And from what I'm reading on Oiler boards, they are not happy with this deal.

LOL.
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Merman1983
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« Reply #6 on: Jan 17, 2009 at 16:10 »

Well this team doesn't need to be giving up any more draft picks for a slight upgrade (if that) to the backup goaltender. And I think Garon's contract is up after this year too. Is he going to resign to backup Fluery?


I realize it's not going to kill em, but it's not good either. I'd rather have kept the pick and done nothing.
« Last Edit: Jan 17, 2009 at 16:16 by Merman1983 » Logged
Captain Chaos
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« Reply #7 on: Jan 17, 2009 at 17:20 »

I realize it's not going to kill em, but it's not good either. I'd rather have kept the pick and done nothing.

I'm on your side with this one Merman. For a team that has a history of getting nothing from draft picks not taken in the first round, and had only a hand-ful of picks last year, I hate losing that 4th rounder in this deal. Sabourin for Garon straight up should have been enough. Throw in Stone, whatever, he's never going to see full-time work in the NHL anyway. But why did Shero have to throw in a draft pick?

Garon's contract is higher than Conklin's, ya think Shero wishes he could have a do-over on that decision?

I honestly don't see Garon pushing Fleury any more that Sabourin did. They both suck and Fleury is suffering from poor play in front of him more than anything. For the last 6 weeks it's looked like we've been killing penalties the entire game even when we're on the power play let alone even-strength.

On the ice, this deal won't make a difference one way or the other. I just don't see why we had to throw in the pick.
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PghSteel-43
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« Reply #8 on: Jan 17, 2009 at 18:23 »

Comments from Shero and Fletcher on the deal....
« Last Edit: Jan 18, 2009 at 11:02 by PghSteel-43 » Logged
PghSteel-43
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« Reply #9 on: Jan 18, 2009 at 00:00 »

Penguins trade Sabourin to Oilers for backup goalie Garon
Sunday, January 18, 2009
By Shelly Anderson, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

Following through on his promise not to make a trade simply because his team is struggling but only if he saw a way to improve the Penguins, general manager Ray Shero yesterday struck a deal with Edmonton.

It was not a blockbuster designed to shake up a team that is 11-16-2 since a six-game winning streak the first half of November, 3-8 in its past 11 games and 2-6 in its past eight home games going into a matinee today against the New York Rangers.

This was a trade that had a lot to do with goaltender Marc-Andre Fleury.

Fleury -- as much of an untouchable as there is on the roster-- was not moved or demoted. Rather, Mathieu Garon was brought in from Edmonton to upgrade the team's goaltending and perhaps push Fleury some.

"At 31, I think Garon is seen as a goalie that still has upside to his game, and maybe a more veteran presence with Marc might be good," Shero said after he sent goaltender Dany Sabourin, minor-league forward Ryan Stone and a fourth-round draft pick in 2011 to the Oilers for Garon.

"That's what happened last season," Shero said of 2007-08, when veteran journeyman Ty Conklin gave the Penguins a strong, 18-8-5 performance, primarily during Fleury's absence because of a high ankle sprain. Fleury watched how Conklin handled being the No. 1 goaltender, how he stick-handled, how he sparked at least some debate on whether Fleury should be handed back the starting job -- and it pushed Fleury to have a strong stretch drive and help the Penguins reach the Stanley Cup final.

Earlier in his Penguins career, Fleury got guidance from veteran backup Jocelyn Thibault.

Sabourin, 28, has been Fleury's road roommate and more of a buddy -- "It's always tough to lose a friend like that," Fleury said -- but Garon could represent more competition.

"He's somebody with experience," said Fleury, who has met Garon only in passing. "I think I can learn from him."

This season, after signing a seven-year, $35 million contract, Fleury, 24 and the first overall pick in the 2003 NHL draft, started 11-5-2. He has slipped to 14-11-2 with a 2.94 goals-against average and a .905 save percentage -- and the latter two numbers have improved some as he went 2-1 in his past two games, including the 3-1 win Friday against Anaheim.

As one of three goaltenders in Edmonton, Garon was expendable.

He won a career-best 31 games with Los Angeles in 2005-06 and was the Oilers' starter last season, going 26-18-1 with a 2.66 goals-against average, before losing the No. 1 job to Dwayne Roloson. This season, he was 6-8-0 and had a 3.17 goals-against average and .895 save percentage.

After going 14 games without a start and one 40-minute relief appearance, Garon was in net Friday night, making 37 saves in a 3-2 win against Colorado.

"We need a little bit more experience with our goaltending," said Penguins coach Michel Therrien, who coached Garon in limited stretches in Montreal when Garon was breaking into the NHL early this decade. "A guy like Garon has been in the league for a while and has been a No. 1 goalie in the past. I think it's going to be a good fit with Fleury. Marc-Andre is still our guy, but we want to make sure he's going to be well-surrounded."

Therrien added that between Fleury and Garon, "performance will dictate the ice time."

Garon, like Sabourin, is eligible for unrestricted free agency in the summer. Garon makes $1 million this season, Sabourin, $525,000.

"It's never good to leave your teammates and a city that you like, but, at the same time, it's going to be good for me because I'll have a chance to play more than I did," Garon told the Edmonton Journal. "I knew from training camp something was going to happen, but I didn't know when or where or who."

While Fleury was out for about a month with a groin injury, Sabourin started off strong stepping in but recently faltered. He is 6-8-2 with a 2.85 goals-against average and a .898 save percentage.

"One of the problems we identified was our goaltending needs to be better," Shero said. "Dany Sabourin is a good goaltender and a nice guy, but we need to be a little better if possible."

Sabourin might not report to the Oilers until after the All-Star break next weekend and could be moved again because of the Oilers' three-goaltender situation.

Stone, a second-round draft pick in 2003, has played in eight NHL games, two this season. The Penguins earlier this season placed him on waivers, but there were no takers.

"This gives Ryan Stone a new opportunity somewhere else, which is something I was trying to do," Shero said.

http://www.postgazette.com/pg/09018/942663-61.stm
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PghSteel-43
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« Reply #10 on: Jan 18, 2009 at 00:08 »

And Fletcher remarks on the trade...

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"He's a quality, veteran goaltender," Penguins assistant general manager Chuck Fletcher said. "He has a proven track record in the NHL. He'll add quality depth and bring leadership."


http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/sports/penguins/s_607698.html
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PghSteel-43
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« Reply #11 on: Jan 18, 2009 at 11:13 »

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"He's a quality, veteran goaltender," Penguins assistant general manager Chuck Fletcher said. "He has a proven track record in the NHL. He'll add quality depth and bring leadership."

The two seasons leading up to this year, one with the Kings and one with the Oilers, he put up a 13-10 record with a .907 SV% with the Kings.  The year after that, he put up 26 wins with a .970 SV% with the Oilers.  What do both of those teams have in common?  Lack of good defense.  Hell, the Kings haven't made the playoffs in five years and Garon still managed to put up pretty solid numbers and the Oilers have not been much better.  I would say Fletcher's observation is pretty fair.

Quote
"At 31, I think Garon is seen as a goalie that still has upside to his game, and maybe a more veteran presence with Marc might be good," Shero said after he sent goaltender Dany Sabourin, minor-league forward Ryan Stone and a fourth-round draft pick in 2011 to the Oilers for Garon.

"That's what happened last season," Shero said of 2007-08, when veteran journeyman Ty Conklin gave the Penguins a strong, 18-8-5 performance, primarily during Fleury's absence because of a high ankle sprain. Fleury watched how Conklin handled being the No. 1 goaltender, how he stick-handled, how he sparked at least some debate on whether Fleury should be handed back the starting job -- and it pushed Fleury to have a strong stretch drive and help the Penguins reach the Stanley Cup final.

Earlier in his Penguins career, Fleury got guidance from veteran backup Jocelyn Thibault.

It's just sad that we have find a veteran goaltender every damn year because Fleury feels the need to be pushed in the first place.  It's not like the guy is in his first, second or third year.  Other's feel Therrien is too hard on him.  Therrien is hard on every player who is not playing up to expectations.  Why should Fleury be any different?  Why do some feel the need to treat this guy with velvet gloves?  Particularly after receiving that huge salary.  We shouldn't have to worry about hurting the guy's feelings every time Therrien calls him out.  He's not six years old.

Yet, since his return he has proven that he still struggles with rebounds and let's in soft goals.  Nevermind his inability to handle the puck behind his net.  Last season, he had an offense that would put up 4-5 goals a game, he doesn't have that luxury this season and not every team/goaltender in the NHL has that luxury.  He has to start stealing some games for us.  That's why he's getting that huge paycheck.  That's also why we drafted him first overall in the 2003 draft.

All of that aside, I see no reason why Garon can't push Fleury for the reasons already stated by Fletcher.  While this team has other issues to resolve, it doesn't mean you simply ignore the one's that can be fixed.  You have to start somewhere.  Shero started by shipping off a goaltender who has looked like shit since early December, an unhappy and underachieving Ryan Stone and a fourth round pick that can be retainable.  It's not like we shipped off a second or third round pick.

Now, it will be interesting to see if he chooses to go after a winger or two.
« Last Edit: Jan 18, 2009 at 11:47 by PghSteel-43 » Logged
PghSteel-43
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« Reply #12 on: Jan 19, 2009 at 07:57 »

Penguins Q&A with Dave Molinari
Monday, January 19, 2009
Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

Q: Ray Shero's decision to trade Dany Sabourin (salary cap hit, $512,000) and Ryan Stone ($346,000) and a draft pick for Mathieu Garon (cap hit, $1.1 million) doesn't make sense based on those numbers. It doesn't appear to make sense based on a comparison of the performances of the two goalies this season, nor does it make sense based on the ages of the goalies, especially since Shero opted for Sabourin rather than keeping Ty Conklin who, along with Marian Hossa, is doing very well for Detroit this year. What is the upside of this trade for the Penguins, I don't see one.

Brian Hampton, Gaithersburg, Md.

MOLINARI:
The upside, such as it is, is that Garon is an upgrade on Sabourin. The thinking here is that the deal won't make a major difference for the Penguins because, if No. 1 goalie Marc-Andre Fleury does not elevate his game to the level the Penguins expect and keep it there -- he certainly did that while stopping 33 shots in a 3-0 victory against the New York Rangers yesterday -- it won't matter who his backup is. However, Garon is generally regarded as a better goaltender than Sabourin -- presumably, most people recognize the perils of direct comparisons of the statistics of two players who played for different teams, against different opponents -- and if Fleury misses some time because of an injury, Garon might be able to get the Penguins a few more points than Sabourin would have.

And just to be clear, Shero did not "choose" Sabourin over Conklin at the end of last season. Sabourin signed a two-year contract with a one-way salary -- meaning he would make the same whether he was in the NHL or the minors -- before last season, while Conklin subsequently accepted a one-year deal that paid him a reduced salary when he played in the American Hockey League.

If the Penguins had re-signed Conklin, they would have had three goalies on one-way contracts this season, which means one would have been drawing an NHL salary to play in the minors. That wouldn't be a very prudent move for a team, while facing the prospect of greatly enhanced revenues when it moves into the city's new multi-purpose arena for the 2010-11 season, still is trying to use its financial resources wisely.

http://www.postgazette.com/pg/09019/942770-125.stm
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PghSteel-43
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« Reply #13 on: Jan 20, 2009 at 00:17 »

New role with Penguins thrills Garon<http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pitt.../s_607931.html
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PghSteel-43
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« Reply #14 on: Jan 23, 2009 at 08:30 »

Since Garon's signing, Fleury has given up three goals over the last three games, helping the Penguins beat the Ducks (3-1) and the Rangers (3-0).  While they lost against Carolina, goaltending was not the reason for the loss.  You are not going to win many games by scoring one goal.  Coincidence?  After seeing what Conklin did with Fleury last season, I don't think so.  After seeing how Fleury responds when he actually has a threat pushing him for his job, I don't think so.

Over the last three games, his rebound control has been excellent, particularly in the Carolina game.  Zero softies allowed and he looks more focused in the net.  As long as Fleury continues to play the way he has for over the last three games, we will not be seeing Garon in the near future.  The second Fleury starts showing signs of failure, Therrien will not hesitate to see what Garon can bring to the table.

Eitherway, Garon is already doing half the job he came in here to do, make Fleury think.  Pushing him to play better and be more focused.  Let him know that he doesn't have the luxury of a spiraling Danny Sabourin 'threatening' him.  Up to this point, it has been working....

New role with Penguins thrills Garon<http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pitt.../s_607931.html
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PghSteel-43
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« Reply #15 on: Jan 30, 2009 at 13:22 »

Garon is expected to make his first start tomorrow night against Toronto according to the PPG.  Also fwiw, Fleury is 3-1-0 with a 1.26 goals-against average and a .961 save percentage in the past four games.
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Merman1983
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« Reply #16 on: Jan 30, 2009 at 13:37 »

Garon is expected to make his first start tomorrow night against Toronto according to the PPG.  Also fwiw, Fleury is 3-1-0 with a 1.26 goals-against average and a .961 save percentage in the past four games.


I was one of the people who was against the trade, but it was definitely worth it if he continues to push Fluery into numbers like that.

I guess my reasoning was someone making 5 mil a year shouldn't need pushed to put max effort into his job. But what the heck do I know.
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PghSteel-43
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« Reply #17 on: Jan 30, 2009 at 14:00 »

Garon is expected to make his first start tomorrow night against Toronto according to the PPG.  Also fwiw, Fleury is 3-1-0 with a 1.26 goals-against average and a .961 save percentage in the past four games.


I was one of the people who was against the trade, but it was definitely worth it if he continues to push Fluery into numbers like that.

I guess my reasoning was someone making 5 mil a year shouldn't need pushed to put max effort into his job. But what the heck do I know.

And I agree with your reasoning 100%, but I don't think that was the only reason for the Penguins going out and getting Garon.

I tend to look at it as the Penguins getting a better backup goaltender in Garon compared to Sabourin.  They upgraded a position that was weak.  We are talking about an Oiler team who lost to the Sabres 10-2 this past Tuesday and yet they still sent Sabourin down to Springfield yesterday.  I'm not sure what that's saying about Dany Sabourin, but it's not good.
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