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Author Topic: Starks Franchised  (Read 2159 times)
LambertsFrontTeeth
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« Reply #10 on: Feb 19, 2009 at 18:16 »

There was simply no alternative. He was the least horrible OT on the team...and as others have pointed out there won't be a better value in FA for a LT, and picking too low in the first to guarantee a ready-to-start OT.
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"Dreith said I hit Sipe too hard. I hit him as hard as I could. Brian has a chance to go out of bounds and he decides not to. He knows I'm going to hit him. And I do. History."
- - - Jack Lambert, after referee Ben Dreith ejected him from a game for knocking out Browns QB Brian Sipe.
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« Reply #11 on: Feb 19, 2009 at 19:52 »

While it's not the best situation in the world, I have to agree it's a viable solution.He's OK, not great by any means.  Maybe by playing LT for a whole offseason he'll improve. 

Our Oline doesn't have to be all Pro Bowlers, which is good because it won't.  Even if we can get to a Harry-esqe average to slightly above average, we'll be better off there than we were in '08.  And '08 was good enough for a ring.
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Kwalla
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« Reply #12 on: Feb 19, 2009 at 20:33 »

I thought more people were onboard with my idea of scrapping most of the offensive line spots and going with tight ends. 

I'm very disappointed. 
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CrPederson
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« Reply #13 on: Feb 20, 2009 at 02:01 »

This was a must do move as said by others. Have to keep some of the line and draft for the future. Now we'll see if Duke Robinson will make it into the 20's and trade our third and first to move up, pick him and have a left side of the line at 6'8" 345 OT and 6'5" 335 LG and then Hartwig 6'2" 314. My only problem is that Starks doesn't have a mean/nasty streak. If Kemo could reign his stupidity in I'd be happy, I love the nasty in him but without smarts he just becomes a liability. If Robinson is gone I don't see Jamon Meredith being a huge reach, 32nd is basically a second round pick. Also would not mind moving up to get Tyson Jackson DE out of LSU. He looks to be one of the best 3-4 DE's in the draft. Fenuki Tupou would be great in the second or Fili Moala
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Preacherman0
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« Reply #14 on: Feb 20, 2009 at 07:36 »

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Boo.

I understand why they did it but still, boo.

Hopefully they can work out something long term since they've tagged him.

Okay, when I first saw all this on ESPN News yesterday, I absolutely lost my mind.  Couldn't believe we did this.  Then I hopped on the board, gave it some thought, and agree that we probably had to do it.

But still...BOO!

There are too many questions left unanswered with this move:

1. Why was Starks not good enough to start last year if he's good enough to franchise this year? 

2. Did we see a sudden change in approach or attitude from Starks when he started playing?  Do we expect him to continue?  Just sayin', if he was fat and lazy with the transition tag, then he may be fat and lazy with the franchise.

3. If he's that valuable (which he may be) why couldn't we work out a long-term, cap-friendly deal?  People weren't beating down his door last year.  If we needed to keep him, LAST year was the time to do the deal.  If he plays great, he'll walk for big bucks.  If he plays average (which I believe he did most of the season), we resing him, but why would we want to?
     I guess that maybe we believe he's only an average tackle, and can be resinged to a reasonable deal after last season; the franchise tag buys us some time to find/develop other talent.

I know that we'll never really know the answers here, but it is frustrating the way that the organization has allowed this to play out.  I don't know why I'm complaining, though--I mean, we ONLY won the Super Bowl!


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He was the least horrible OT on the team

High praise, Lambert!  Grin  I think you're right, and I guess I would echo others in hoping that he may look better with better talent around him.  Or, he'll be exposed as average and we'll be able to keep him for depth.


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Now we'll see if Duke Robinson will make it into the 20's and trade our third and first to move up

I don't know that I want Duke Robinson, and I'm certainly not sure about giving up picks to get him.  He looked very mediocre against NFL-caliber talent vs. Florida; in fact, I'd even say that he looked bad at times.  That's a huge risk on a R1 olineman.  Now, I'm not sure that we're going to do any better, but we have to be very careful.  I honestly don't think we can afford to miss again on the oline if we hope to see this team improve next season.


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« Reply #15 on: Feb 20, 2009 at 08:28 »

Agree with Preach on Duke Robinson, and no way would I trade up for him or Tyson Jackson.  Maybe at 1.32, maybe.  But he's limited also.

I think there are some very good guards we can look at R2-3.  R1, IMO, is either a top C or OT.  If we did go DE, I think Jarron Gilbert is moving on up for me -- would need some coaching, but much more upside than Jackson.  Think guys last year like Jason Jones or Kendall Langford, but more so.
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« Reply #16 on: Feb 20, 2009 at 08:51 »

Funny thing is, Starks isn't even the most questionable guy to get franchised. Shane Graham, Bo Scaife, and Dunta Robinson all got franchised. Antonio Bryant too, who wasn't even on a roster prior to last season.
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jcharding
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« Reply #17 on: Feb 20, 2009 at 09:56 »

I agree with the consensus in that (a) I'm not wild about this and (b) I understood why it occurred.  I think that it frees them up, in the short term and possibly the long-term, to solidify other needs.  The big sticking point on any long-term Starks negotiations will probably be signing bonus (he sometimes seems to become unmotivated and is beaten out by lesser talents).  I also wonder if this was timed to the Jordan Gross negotiations (i.e. as soon as the Steelers saw Gross re-signed with Carolina they opted to franchise Max).  I think they will draft a second Tony Hills in the 3rd or 4th round this year and let 2008 Hills and the ultimate 2009 Tony Hills fight to the death to be the long-term solution to the other tackle position.

Its possible that Max was not only the best tackle on the roster last year, but the best OL period.  I can't think of anyone who outperformed him - and given that (as others have stated) he has now started for two SB winning teams its possible that we focus too much on Max's flaws.  He doesn't get beaten terribly often, he doesn't commit penalties very often .... maybe he is better than we commonly appreciate...
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« Reply #18 on: Feb 20, 2009 at 10:17 »

I agree with the general thinking here, and the team may clearly be thinking that they can draft a better interior lineman at 1.32 than they can a tackle.

I wouldn't be surprised if they went for a blocking TE in round 3 or 4 either -- I think the Super Bowl made clear that not only are Kemoteau and Stapleton weaknesses, but that Spaeth cannot block. He was run over, when he wasn't being run around, in every 'big' set we tried to throw out there.

The O-line may not take a ton of work to improve in 2009 (caveat being they were dreadful in 2008 and improvement means getting up an NFL average standard) if the following happens:
* We draft a high-quality, future Pro Bowl G in the first round who can start immediately at LG (should be very doable)
* Get Simmons back healthy for RG (I know he's not great, but he's better than Stapleton)
* Motivate Starks, and get him to improve as our starting LT
* and acquire a very good blocking TE or FB either in the draft or free agency (this shouldn't be hard to do if we just want to do it)

In terms of 2010 and beyond, I think the second day of the draft should again involve taking some potshots at the OT position until we're in a position to draft a very good one in the first round or land a quality free agent.
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jonzr
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« Reply #19 on: Feb 20, 2009 at 15:01 »

Maybe some crazy arse team will sign Max away.  I'd rather have the compensation of two first rounders.
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