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Author Topic: Mike Tomlin  (Read 2969 times)
Preacherman0
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« on: Dec 09, 2012 at 20:39 »

I have been a huge fan of the guy.

But there isn't a single damn legit excuse for the inconsistency of this team. Yeah, let-down, big emotional win last week, blahblahblah.

To come out and lay an enormous pile of shee-hah on the Steeler logo right at mid-field on your home turf against a POS team like the Chargers...that's piss-poor.

And that lies at the feet of the coach and his staff.
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msdmnr2002
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« Reply #1 on: Dec 09, 2012 at 23:20 »

Quote
But there isn't a single damn legit excuse for the inconsistency of this team. Yeah, let-down, big emotional win last week, blahblahblah.

If it were one game, fine.  But if someone were to say Steelers will win At Baltimore, At Cincy, and AT the Giants, and in week 13 they will basically be out of the division race and struggling for wild card - and the teams on the schedule are basically what people thought they'd be going in - I would currently be living in a cardboard box because I'd have bet everything against that.

Totally agree that coaching is a problem now.

In reality, with Ben's injury we should probably have been swept by Baltimore.  But I'd trade the one win in for the four we pissed away - Oakland, Tennessee, Cleveland, SD.  10-3 with Ben missing 3 games would be about right.  12-1 if we can keep the Chief turds off of BBR for a few plays.
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Finnegans Wake
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« Reply #2 on: Dec 10, 2012 at 09:49 »

Tomlin has not coached above the line.  We know that the standard is the standard, if you will.
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aj_law
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« Reply #3 on: Dec 10, 2012 at 10:56 »

To come out and lay an enormous pile of shee-hah on the Steeler logo right at mid-field on your home turf against a POS team like the Chargers...that's piss-poor.

And that lies at the feet of the coach and his staff.

Totally agree that coaching is a problem now.

Let me start this by saying that I'm neither a huge fan or hater of Tomlin.  I'm kinda ambivalent about him.  General assessment, I'd say he's a good, not great, coach.  IMO, his most obvious flaws are his clock management and overall in game management skills.  I think part of the reason for that is he gets too caught up in the moment to keep a 30K foot view.

Now, no offense to either of you guys and I'm as fuckin' pissed as anybody else, but I'm not going to throw as much of yesterday's performance at Tomlin's feet as a lot of people seem ready to do. 

Similar to QBs, coaches get too much credit when things are going well and too much blame when they're not.  They devise a gameplan, prepare the team and oversee its execution.  To the best of my knowledge, I haven't heard anything that would lead me to believe that Tomlin & Co. aren't doing that.  I haven't heard of any mid week movie trips, nature hikes or pina coladas and lounge chairs being offered at practice.  He strikes me as a disciplinarian and from the things I've read/seen, a coach that drills the fundamentals. 

At some point, don't the players have to become accountable and execute?

Ben has to make good decisions with this throws.

Receivers have to make catches.

The offensive line has to do a better job of blocking.

The front seven has to put more pressure on the opposing QB.

The defense has to do a better job of tackling.

Less giveaways; more takeaways.

I'm sitting there watching the game yesterday.  Early on I'm yelling at the screen and as it wore on, I got quieter and angrier.  By the end, I was fuming, but eerily quiet.  There were only a couple of points during those 3 hours that I actually cursed out the coaching staff.  The first was when they called a WR screen inside their own 10 yard line and the other was a little later when it just felt like they reverted to sandlot football on offense.  A big reason for that was probably the big hole they had fallen into by that point so I'm sure the gameplan had pretty much gone out the window by then, anyway.

I dunno.  Maybe I'm missing something.  Players just weren't making plays.  They made too many mistakes and weren't getting the job done.  I don't know how much poor coaching played a part in Ben throwing that pickle in their own RZ; numerous dropped passes by several receivers; poor tackling on defense; or an inability to put pressure on Livers who was playing behind an O-line that was thrown together on the bus ride over to the stadium.  That dude was comfortable as hell out there being all chummy chummy and yucking it up with various defenders.  He should've been shitting cats every time he dropped back to pass.  When they needed to, these millionaires just couldn't step up and make a play...

I'm rambling now.  Sorry.  I'm done.
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otismalibu
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« Reply #4 on: Dec 10, 2012 at 11:00 »

Not that Cowher didn't shit the bed more often than not in big games, but he could often fire up his team after an uninspiring 1st half.
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Finnegans Wake
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« Reply #5 on: Dec 10, 2012 at 12:39 »

That's all true, aj, but the question becomes Why are the players suddenly misfiring so badly?  Especially one week after playing so well against division rival Baltimore?  If you are a great coach, or even a good coach, you might have one anomalous game per year: you win the games you should win, but against the bottom ~8-10 teams (Raiders, Titans, Browns, and yes, this year's Chargers at this stage in the season), you do not consistently and inexplicably fail to play football.  And as we know, it happened in 2009 as well.  There are always "buts":  But we had injuries to key players in 2009... But Ben was just coming back from injury... But for some strange reason over half of this year's giveaways occurred in just two games...

However, look at a coach like Belichick one hand and Jason Garrett on the other.  How disparate is the talent between these teams?  Belichick adjusts, rarely loses headscratcher games (and how many 3-6 headscratchers in one season?), keeps the team progressing rather than lunging and faltering.  Garrett's Cowboys are madly inconsistent.  Tomlin is between the two, most years more consistent, but with some bad stretches of pure ugly.  When the team looks lethargic, it's his job to put the pedal to the medal, not just wait and see how the gameplan he worked up this week plays out, as if everything is pre-programmed.  By putting the pedal to the medal, I don't just mean going for 2 when it's fucking obvious you need to (rather than save it in your pocket or whateverthefuck), or showing Cowher-esque spittle, I mean giving the order to Haley to pick up the pace, the order to DL to get the win on 3rd down, to show some evidence that you can actually impact gametime events rather than spectate.

Tomlin does a lot of non-gameday stuff very well.  One aspect that is lacking about non-gameday is the integration of young players and backups.  SD put in a bunch of OL scrubs who outplayed our front 7.  We insert Curtis Brown and it's like he's not a 2nd year, 3rd round pick who's ready to shine, he's getting burned consistently.  Where is Cameron Heyward?  Why did it take so long to get Dwyer into the lineup?

We keep seeing the same issues cropping up like whack-a-mole.  Special teams.  Clock issues.  Field position issues.  Tempo issues.  Giveaways.  Lack of D pressure.  Stupid penalties (from vets who should know better).  Lethargy and complacency.  I'm sick of the Random Wheel of Shitty Play.  I can accept that some of this is on the players, but not all.  The team does not feel like it's clicking, week to week, and hasn't frankly for quite some time.
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msdmnr2002
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« Reply #6 on: Dec 10, 2012 at 13:21 »

I think Finny's on for this one, AJ.  I hear you if it's one, even two games.  But it is inexplicable to beat Cincy, Balty, and the Giants on the road and lose to Cleveland, Oakland, and Tennessee (and SD at home).  If that's players, then you have the wrong players.  But I don't think we do.  For some reason, we just don't put weaker teams away often enough.  We shouldn't have to even be completely jacked up emotionally for those games.  If we just do our business, we win.

Cowher had his flaws, but I'd bet his record against sub-.500 teams is much better than Tomlin's, and our overall personnel may well be better now (although it does seem injuries are a bigger issue in last few years than I recall).   When you repeatedly underperform, coaching is part of that.

I thought of posting earlier I'd like to have Cowher for the "easy" games, and Tomlin for the big ones. 
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aj_law
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« Reply #7 on: Dec 10, 2012 at 13:27 »

Yeah, I see what you're saying and I can see both sides.  All good points.  

Maybe I expect too much from the guys that are on the field and not enough from the guy wearing the headset.  Still seems a bit counterproductive as Tomlin isn't the guy that threw the interception or dropped one of the half dozen or so passes that were missed.  He also wasn't the reason Ben hit Paulson in the ass (?) on that WR screen or the reason Brown tried to pick up that ball in the EZ instead of just knocking it OOB.  He also wasn't one of the guys that missed a tackle and allowed Ronnie Brown to pick up that 1st down on 3rd and long.  I digress.  I've already beaten this dead horse to a greasy mess.

I will say, more to your point, that there are probably quite a few Saints fans that believe their team would be in the playoff hunt (at least) had Payton not gotten suspended.

I just think that Tomlin might be a convenient scapegoat.  Its not like his team quit on him and got blown out 58-0...
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Finnegans Wake
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« Reply #8 on: Dec 10, 2012 at 13:40 »

Quote from: msdmnr
I thought of posting earlier I'd like to have Cowher for the "easy" games, and Tomlin for the big ones. 

I think that's spot on.

Quote from: aj
I will say, more to your point, that there are probably quite a few Saints fans that believe their team would be in the playoff hunt (at least) had Payton not gotten suspended.

And Payton is another excellent example of extreme consistency.  Even with a defense that's perpetually a sieve (a la Dungy's Colts), look at his record.

I don't know what the problem is.  Lack of fundamentals?  Not enough situational reps?  Simply overlooking lesser foes, devoting more gameplanning to the big fish? 

The Paulson thing was on Paulson: you can't get trucked backwards on that play, you simply cannot.  If you're inserting yourself into the line of fire, you become the equivalent of a DL getting his hand into the passing lane.  Of course, it's also on Tomlin and Colbert, for not upgrading the position adequately:  Paulson's JAG, and probably shouldn't have been in a critical blocking situation to begin with.

Round and round it goes.
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aj_law
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« Reply #9 on: Dec 10, 2012 at 13:48 »

We shouldn't have to even be completely jacked up emotionally for those games.  If we just do our business, we win.

I think that's exactly how the players felt for yesterday's game.  I also think that's why they made so many mistakes and lost.  

Classic TARP game.  You could just sense it from the players:  "San Diego come in here and get a win?  N'way!  When that happen last?  Under Reagan?"

I will say that it's definitely a part of the HC's responsibilities to prepare against that, tho.

I thought of posting earlier I'd like to have Cowher for the "easy" games, and Tomlin for the big ones.

Careful.  Betcha Cowher considered the '94 AFCC game an "easy" one too.
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