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Author Topic: And it begins...128 days away  (Read 6298 times)
msdmnr2002
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« on: Dec 31, 2013 at 10:31 »

Seven round mock from Matt Miller at Bleacher Report:

Steelers

Round 1 - Greg Robinson, OT Auburn
Round 2 - Kelvin Benjamin, WR Florida St
ROund 3 - None
Round 4 - Anthony Harris, FS Virginia
Round 5 - Demarcus Lawrence, OLB Boise St
ROund 6 - Andrew Jackson, ILB Western Kentucky
ROund 7 - Silas Redd, RB UCLA

No real comments from me here, just something to read.  Overall I would be surprised if the top 5 picks were actually 4 QBs and Sammy Watkins (#2 overall).
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« Reply #1 on: Dec 31, 2013 at 11:30 »

So where did they end up in the draft?  Gotta figure it's smack-dab in the middle.
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« Reply #2 on: Dec 31, 2013 at 11:32 »

#15

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1905204-2014-nfl-draft-order-updated-look-at-first-round-after-week-17

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Finnegans Wake
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« Reply #3 on: Dec 31, 2013 at 11:54 »

Plus, we should get comps:  possibly a R3 for Wallace, and a decent round for Lewis, plus a late one for Mendy. 

IMO, a R1 OT is probably less a priority the way Beachum has played.

Miller's got some screwy shit in his mock though, some real weird values.  For us:  OT in R1 does not appear to be the best value.  A lot of talk about the Steelers + Benjamin, but not sure I buy it.  No CB?  Day 3 safety?  Late round ILB?
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« Reply #4 on: Dec 31, 2013 at 11:58 »

Agreed with the OL, not sure it's the priority we thought early in the season.  Ben seems to be getting rid of it quicker, maybe Haley has broken through somehow, drilled it into his head.  Plus, the ground game was improving.

Not sure of what's available, but a CB might be the best bang for the buck.  WR would be nice,  considering the FAs. 
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SCacalaki
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« Reply #5 on: Dec 31, 2013 at 16:20 »

Was reading steelersdepot.com re: Beachum's work.  The stats show him as very good and Tomlin basically agreed.  If the value is OT, fine.  But I assume they are ok with the three they currently have.  WR or anywhere on D is my pick
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aj_law
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« Reply #6 on: Jan 01, 2014 at 10:13 »

IMO, a R1 OT is probably less a priority the way Beachum has played.

I agri.

OT should only be a consideration if something stupid happens like Matthews or possibly Lewan are still available.

Can't believe I'm saying this again about another Spartan, but Darqueze Dennard* should get STRONG consideration in R1.  Don't know if he'll be available in R2.

*Weird Name Theory LOCK.
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« Reply #7 on: Jan 02, 2014 at 08:19 »

Agree WRT to Dennard, he's got to be in the running for R1.  Who was our last R1 CB, Chad Scott?!
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Merman1983
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« Reply #8 on: Jan 02, 2014 at 08:50 »

Curious on everyone's thoughts on Louis Nix III in round 1?  Have seen alot of mocks with the Steelers drafting him and him dropping to 1.15 due to the knee injury.  I admittedly only saw him play against Pitt and he did not seem to dominate like you would hope a blue chip prospect would.

If he could turn into Casey Hampton v 2.0 and plug and play from day one, it would make a huge difference.  I know this defense needs speed but getting a blue chip NT means a tricking down of improvement in DEs (Mac to end) and depth (Woods, Fang as depth guys).
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« Reply #9 on: Jan 02, 2014 at 10:18 »

I'll reserve judgment on all NTs until the combine:  IMO, one of the better metrics for determining a fit in the 3-4 is reps at 225#.   Guys who don't clear 30 reps tend to not cut it.  Alameda Ta'amu hit the numbers but his film was all wrong.  And I sort of get that vibe from Nix, has the frame, appears to help the production of the F7, but I haven't had any kind of wow moments over him.

And with NT being a 2-down player, not sure R1 is a good value.
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scballersc
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« Reply #10 on: Jan 02, 2014 at 13:12 »

I've taken some heat for loving players from my alma mater on this board (e.g. Manti Te'o), but will say that Nix is no different in my eyes.  He played a true Steelers NT in college in the sense that he was double teamed on every play.  As a result, you won't see many Clowneyesque highlights, but you will see a slew of players around him that benefitted from him being in the middle of the defense, including Te'o, Kapron Lewis Moore, and Stephon Tuitt (who is my favorite of the bunch).

My only hesitation is the value component for a first rounder discussed by Finny below.
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Merman1983
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« Reply #11 on: Jan 02, 2014 at 13:44 »

Does being a 2-down player really make him that much less valuable?  I mean second and long and third and long are much more winnable downs than third and short or we just gashed you up the middle for 56 yards. 

I do see the point though.


Also seen us linked to OLB out of BYU Kyle Van Noy.  I'm not sure my television would survive us taking another pass rushing OLB in round one.

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Finnegans Wake
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« Reply #12 on: Jan 02, 2014 at 14:02 »

Good points, sc and Merman.  One other issue I'd have is his conditioning, which reminds me somewhat of Terrence Cody, who appears to be nothing special for the Ratties.  On the plus side, he does appear to have it from the neck on up, and yes, he's done the little things right that don't always pop on film like a 4-3 DE or a pass-rushing OLB.

Will have to look at him a bit closer, but right now my gut says an offensive playmaker (WR or TE) in R1 would ease losing Sanders and help the O stake leads.  R2 and R3 should have some secondary talent.  But man, it's all wide open right now.
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aj_law
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« Reply #13 on: Jan 02, 2014 at 14:28 »

Will have to look at him a bit closer, but right now my gut says an offensive playmaker (WR or TE) in R1 would ease losing Sanders and help the O stake leads.  R2 and R3 should have some secondary talent.  But man, it's all wide open right now.

Meh, there are plenty of decent outside guys that could probably be had for a reasonable deal via FA when (if) Sanders leaves.  James Jones.  Golden Tate.  Hakeem Nicks.  Andre Roberts.  Unless a team jumps in and overpays, they should be able to get somebody like that for about what Sanders cost them, maybe a milly more per, on average.

Good WRs can be had on the cheap.  Good CBs can't.  You gotta draft 'em.  

I'm cereal, if they don't go defense (CB, NT, ILB or possibly S) in R1-R3, I'll shit a cat; only exception is if a solid, R1 type prospect falls into R2 or R3 at OT, WR/TE or QB.

Edit:  And, fuck you, Bill Leavy for making me talk about this stuff this early in the "season."
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scballersc
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« Reply #14 on: Jan 02, 2014 at 19:09 »

Does being a 2-down player really make him that much less valuable?  I mean second and long and third and long are much more winnable downs than third and short or we just gashed you up the middle for 56 yards. 

I do see the point though.


Also seen us linked to OLB out of BYU Kyle Van Noy.  I'm not sure my television would survive us taking another pass rushing OLB in round one.



I guess my point is that as a R1 NT that ends up having only marginal talent you may find yourself on the roster bubble and often times cut.  Compare that to a R1 end, backer, DB, olineman or WR that ends up to be average/slightly above average; more times that not you'll find yourself playing a more influential role, whether it be as a third WR, 6th olineman, or nickel.  Taking a player at those position is in a sense, more of a secure pick from a value perspective (which is my thinking about Nix).  However if you're 100 percent sold on a NT, then do it because they are obviously substantially more difficult to replace as a matter of supply and demand.
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Merman1983
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« Reply #15 on: Jan 03, 2014 at 10:07 »

Does being a 2-down player really make him that much less valuable?  I mean second and long and third and long are much more winnable downs than third and short or we just gashed you up the middle for 56 yards. 

I do see the point though.


Also seen us linked to OLB out of BYU Kyle Van Noy.  I'm not sure my television would survive us taking another pass rushing OLB in round one.



I guess my point is that as a R1 NT that ends up having only marginal talent you may find yourself on the roster bubble and often times cut.  Compare that to a R1 end, backer, DB, olineman or WR that ends up to be average/slightly above average; more times that not you'll find yourself playing a more influential role, whether it be as a third WR, 6th olineman, or nickel.  Taking a player at those position is in a sense, more of a secure pick from a value perspective (which is my thinking about Nix).  However if you're 100 percent sold on a NT, then do it because they are obviously substantially more difficult to replace as a matter of supply and demand.

Not to mention special teams.  Good point.  This defense has so many potential holes that it's pretty open.  Say Ike get cut for cap purposes, that will probably change draft strategy.  The reason for my original question is that if any position can jump in, I'm thinking NT is it. 
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« Reply #16 on: Jan 05, 2014 at 10:14 »

*Homer alert*

I'll take Sammy Watkins, please

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Merman1983
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« Reply #17 on: Jan 05, 2014 at 10:35 »

*Homer alert*

I'll take Sammy Watkins, please



He is a beast,  I don't think he makes it out of the top 10 though.
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Finnegans Wake
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« Reply #18 on: Jan 05, 2014 at 15:57 »

Yeah, he doesn't make it to 1.15.

Watkins looked thicker and stronger than I had remembered.  And of course fast.

Some pretty good WRs this draft, might be able to get a nice value later.
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« Reply #19 on: Jan 07, 2014 at 09:32 »

Unlikely but the first half of the first round tends to unfold in odd ways.  Run on QBs, trade ups, etc. 

Would take Watkins or Evans if available.  I don't think the Steelers take an O tackle based on what Beachum did.  I don't think Beachum plays well for long but I bet the Steelers believe he will.

Would take a CB, though I don't think rookie CBs do well their first year and would not see it as an answer if Ike is cut
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« Reply #20 on: Jan 08, 2014 at 09:07 »

CB I liked last year, Xav Rhodes, did well as a rookie, but not sure any of these guys is as physical.

Agree on OT.  I'd say the 3 WRs in R1 to look at would be Watkins (obv.), Evans, and Lee.  Some buzz about Benjamin, but he's not in the same tier.  Lots of R2/3 value at WR this year.
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aj_law
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« Reply #21 on: Jan 08, 2014 at 11:40 »

CB I liked last year, Xav Rhodes, did well as a rookie, but not sure any of these guys is as physical.

So far, I like what I see from Dennard and Fuller.  Good ball awareness.  Good tacklers.  Dennard played lotta zone.  Fuller probably more man.
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« Reply #22 on: Jan 08, 2014 at 12:00 »

Yeah, I like those guys.  Fuller is undervalued right now, IMO. 
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Merman1983
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« Reply #23 on: Jan 08, 2014 at 15:10 »

Some buzz about Allan Robinson in late round one.  Think he'd be great value in round two for the Steelers.

Outside of Watkins, not sure I'd take a WR at 1.15.  Guys like Evans scare me.  Big body, lack of elite speed bring back Mike Williams flashbacks.
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aj_law
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« Reply #24 on: Feb 04, 2014 at 15:03 »

Wasn't sure where to add this so I guess I'll just put it here.

Saw two mocks recently that didn't have Pittsburgh drafting Nix.

Draftcountdown has them selecting LB CJ Mosley from 'Bama and yesterday, USA Today had them taking WR Marqise Lee from USC (with Lewan still on the board too).
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« Reply #25 on: Feb 05, 2014 at 08:46 »

Robinson is a tough eval.  Young QB, not much other WR talent.  Want to see his workouts, but I agree he'd be a nice R2 target or possibly a guy in a trade down.  I love Evans as a collegiate WR, and think he can transition to the bigs (as opposed to, say, a Mike Williams) - just keep thinking how he owned Bama.  Sort of a hybrid, H-back sort of player.  Again, workouts will be worth looking at: 10-yard split, and how nifty he is in the cones and shuttles.

Lee is another hard eval, due to injury and poor QB play, but he does drop his fair share.  Looks like some good OTs may get pushed down, and frankly if I had to choose between Lewan and Lee I'd take the OT and poke around for WRs later - deep class, tons of R3/4 talent IMO, and BBR is already working out with Wheaton and Moye in Cali.  FFS, our little Ben?  I'd thought he'd be eating frozen pizzas and watching Ron Burgundy.

Backing off of Nix.  Don't think NT is the best value, and Nix is inconsistent in game tape.  Mosley is a consideration; have to compare any ILB R1 to Kuechly WRT value.  But he's still in my top 15.

Is Calvin Pryor in the R1 convo with LOL Dix?
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