2014 NFL HOF Class

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kluisi61:
No brainers:
Walter JonesDerrick BrooksMichael StrahanRay Guy (senior inductee)
Surprises:
Andre ReedAeneas Williams
Unknown:
Claude Humphrey (senior inductee)
Snubs:
Tim BrownMarvin HarrisonJerome BettisWill ShieldsKevin GreenCharles Haley
Other Finalists:
Morten AndersonEddie DeBartolo, Jr.Tony DungyJohn Lynch

Discussion:
I think Ray Guy should have been in long ago, so no issue with that. The other three no brainers above are just that and do not require any discussion really.

As for the other inductees, I don't know anything about Humphrey. He was before my time. Maybe ask Finny or Keystone *ducks*.

I think Brown, Harrison, and Bettis were the biggest snubs. Both Harrison and Brown were more deserving WRs than Reed (I would put Brown in first actually). Also, I think Bettis is more deserving of a spot than Reed or Williams. The other snubs probably deserve to be in, but I wouldn't bump anyone who did get in for them.

As for the others, Anderson and DeBartolo deserve it, but its hard for contributors and specialists to get in (just ask Ray Guy). Lynch will also probably be in at some point, but again no problem with him waiting. Finally, Dungy can wait for a long time as far as I'm concerned. First, he is just a coach with no player HOF credentials. Second, it seems to me that when compared to other coaches in the HOF, his only noteworthy coaching credentials are an excellent regular season winning percentage and winning a super bowl while black.

139-69 (.668) winning percentage in the regular season
9-10 (.474) losing percentage in the postseason
1 Super Bowl win (XLI in 2007 - 2006 NFL season)

Compared to these coaches already in (in no particular order), it doesn't add up:
CoachRegular SeasonPost SeasonChampionshipsSuper BowlsSB LossesOtherGuy Chamberlin.784no postseason in 1920s400N/AJohn Madden.763.563010ContributorVince Lombardi.738.900340SB Trophy NameGeorge Halas .682.667 600Don Shula.678.528024Only Undefeated Season EverPaul Brown.672.529 700Earl (Curly) Lambeau .631.600 600Chuck Noll.566.667 040Weeb Ewbank.502.800 210Joe Gibbs.621.708 031Tom Landry.607.55602 3Marv Levy.561.579 0044 Super Bowl Appearances in a rowEarle (Greasy) Neale.594.750 200Bill Parcells.570.579 02 1Hank Stram.575.625 111Bill Walsh.609.714 030
In my opinion, coaching Hall of Fame credentials are made in the post season and championships, not the regular season and skin color.

By the way, the following coaches are in the HOF, but do not really support my argument (though some could be argued to be comparable). They are included for completeness.


CoachRegular SeasonPost SeasonChampionshipsSuper BowlsSB LossesOtherGeorge Allen.712.222 001Steve Owen.602.200 200Sid Gillman.552.167 200Jimmy Conzelman.580.500 200Bud Grant.622.455 004Ray Flaherty.684.333 200
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Finnegans Wake:
So much fail with this, and you've detailed it nicely.  The Bettis sham deserves its own thread, but stats speak for themselves; who were his QBs?; ask anyone in the AFCN who played against him; watch the old footage when Bus was new.  These idiots have short memories, and must only think of late-era Bus.  Course, ask Urlacher 'bout that, too.

Aeneas?  20th on the career INT board.  I mean, a very good player and all, but you can't say Bettis or Brown don't deserve a spot and Williams does.  He had a career as long as LeBeau, longer season, played in a passing era, still had 7 fewer picks than Lonesome Dick.  He did tie for the league lead in picks (9) one year (1994).  Start making the case for Richard Sherman.

Andre Reed is borderline, IMO, but Brown and Harrison are 6th and 7th all-time with 14,934 and 14,580, while Reed is 13th at 13,198.  Different systems, and people forget how much the Bills relied on a balanced attack with the ground game.  IMO Reed is more deserving than Williams, heartwarming tale of a Kutztown U. guy making it big, always thought he was clutch.  But hard to make his case over the other two.

By the numbers, Humphrey looks deserving, although I can't remember him frankly.

Dungy is an interesting case.  You could say Grudes essentially took a Dungy team and got a freebie Lombardi.  Dungy rebuilt two foundering franchises, one based on D (TB), one on O (Indy).  Are the postseason shortcomings of the Colts due to their lopsided composition, or Manning out-thinking himself?  He had a rather balanced Broncos team and looked like the wide-eyed 2nd year guy, instead of the far more composed Russell Wilson.  Seriously, I think it's difficult to separate Peyton's late season skittishness from Dungy's discussion.  I would have probably given more blame to the Colts D before the implosion of the Broncos last night; in fairness, that Seahawks D is awesome though.

John Lynch?  26 career picks?  A smart player, a good player, tough STs guy, not a HOFer, no way, no how.

kluisi61:
Quote from: Finnegans Wake on Feb 03, 2014 at 08:59

John Lynch?  26 career picks?  A smart player, a good player, tough STs guy, not a HOFer, no way, no how.


I'm not really making a case for or against Lynch because I can see either side really, but his game was never really based on interceptions. It was based on decapitating guys crossing the middle (when that was still legal and encouraged) and being a big hitter. He was in the pro-bowl 9 times for what that's worth.

Finnegans Wake:
Quote from: kluisi61 on Feb 03, 2014 at 10:15

Quote from: Finnegans Wake on Feb 03, 2014 at 08:59

John Lynch?  26 career picks?  A smart player, a good player, tough STs guy, not a HOFer, no way, no how.


I'm not really making a case for or against Lynch because I can see either side really, but his game was never really based on interceptions. It was based on decapitating guys crossing the middle (when that was still legal and encouraged) and being a big hitter. He was in the pro-bowl 9 times for what that's worth.


True.  Good point.

Merman1983:
I don't know what is going to piss me off more, Bettis not getting in or the excuses they will come up with not to put in Hines, Ben and Troy.

The guy had 2 years with a real Franchise QB and one was Ben's rookie year.  The 3.9 per carry seems to be a sticking point, but that was due to more of a role change than anything.  Riggins had the same, Curtis Martin .1 higher, Emmitt Smith with the greatest team of the 90s, 2 other hall of famers on the same offense 4.1.

Longevity and being useful beyond your prime is apparently punished. 

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