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Author Topic: Steelers transition tag Worilds  (Read 3614 times)
Finnegans Wake
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« on: Mar 03, 2014 at 15:59 »

IMO, bold stupidity.

As I commented at Steelers Depot, none of the protection of the franchise tag, yet nearly as expensive.  What's the point?  To show we're too cheap to actually franchise tag Worilds?  To show we want to keep him but know someone else will throw more money his way?  Sometimes the way the FO operates boils my fucking nuts.
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SCacalaki
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« Reply #1 on: Mar 03, 2014 at 17:55 »

Can the franchise tag be rescinded by the team (until a certain date)?  I think it can be, though cap compliance still applies.

I guess the cap situation is what drove the Steelers to the T-tag v. F-tag.  That extra ~$2m must be tough to squeeze out.  Late reconfig to Heath's contract; that's it thus far though I assume the tackle from AZ is gone (but maybe not reported???).  What about additional cuts?  Ike, Foote

Or, it is possible that the Steelers feel they aren't far enough apart in a deal for Worilds that they can get something done within the next few days?  Unlikely, as the T-tag only allows the market to set what the Steelers will or won't pay.
The Steelers already know what they are willing to pay.  Other times likely have a good idea as well.  It's like the a-hole on Price Is Right who bids one dollar over what the last guy bid (or sumthin like that).

The Steelers haven't handled their LBs well in quite a while.  Maybe not all their fault, as Woodley got fat on his own.  Timmons is ok but hasn't been the high-impact player via my expectations for a 1.16 pick.  Who knows with Jarvis and Foote's injury last year should finally put him out to pasture.  Bruce Davis, Thad Gibson, Mike "I like the look in his eyes" Humpal, I guess Steve Sylvester round out more recent washouts. 

Once Zig Hood signs elsewhere, I think only David Johnson remains from C/O 2008 and 2009.

Maybe Worilds gets fat after signing, whatever city it may be
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aj_law
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« Reply #2 on: Mar 04, 2014 at 08:47 »

What's the point? 

It's temporary.  No way they let him play out '14 under the tag.  Two sides are likely far apart on what they consider fair market value.  Pittsburgh must feel pretty confident that letting him set market price isn't going to come back and bite 'em in the arse.  As much as I think they need him, I'm inclined to agree.

He'll either get a big offer from somebody and be gone (fine); get little to no interest on the market and sing a reasonable deal in Pittsburgh (preferrable); or get an offer from another team that puts Pittsburgh in the tough position to either match or lose him.

Somebody out there gonna overpay for a guy whose entire body of work is essentially a half season?  Good luck with that.
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« Reply #3 on: Mar 04, 2014 at 09:28 »

Thing is, for $1.7M more you franchise him and get an assurance of high-level picks if a cap-rich team signs him away.  As it stands, nothing in 2014 and only a 2015 comp if that scenario unfolds.  So the difference, in terms of cap, is minor, but huge in terms of ROI. 

Reports circulating that ~12 teams are kicking the tires on Woodley, and don't forget the frenzy to overpay barely-tested players (see:  Krugman, Paul). 

So:  for the next few weeks of FA, any opportunities gleaned by the Heat restructure (details pending), the Levi Brown cut (inevitable), and various and sundry restructures (AB, Pola, Ike, Timmons, Ben) are for naught, going to get us under the cap that we are already over, and paying for the privilege of treading water while teams decide whether to overpay for Worilds. 

Short version:  shit or get off the pot, Colbert.

Best of all worlds, Worilds (who, unlike Woodley, has at least shown us a solid partial season of production in recent memory) gets a medium-sized deal rather than some whopper; he is allowed to play LOLB, where he can pressure the QB more effectively than Woodley, who is a better ROLB matchup anyway; Jarvis is (a la Timmons) moved inside to buck, where his frame and speed might actually work, rather than benchwarming behind the other OLBs, thus removing the need to use a high draft pick at ILB, where we currently have Juan and a rather motley crew of JAGs, never-weres, an insufficient stopgap (Williams), and a revenant (Spence) of questionable speed and durability.

This being Colbert's and Tomlin's world to bugger, I doubt these things happen, any of them. 

Forget where I read, but alongside the Broncos and Raiders, we're at the very bottom of teams with players signed beyond 2014.  Unlike them, we're not rosy with cap space.  Buggered every which way due to overpaying to keep the ol' gang together (emphasis on OLD), with the defense literally falling off in chunks like a fucking leper.  Offense may be close, lacking maybe one playmaking receiver and some OT depth, but the D is a travesty not soon fixed.  Even moving Jones inside begs the need for backup OLB (and ILB) help, something done to help anchor the DL, and as to the secondary I'll stick by my recommendation to draft (at least) 3 DB, preferably one CB early, one S early-to-mid, and one developmental CB.

With little room for error.
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SCacalaki
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« Reply #4 on: Mar 04, 2014 at 09:59 »

The problem with losing Worilds is that the Steelers haven't been particularly good LB evaluators over the past 6-7 years.  Sure, figuring out who is or isn't after the 3rd round is often very difficult but there is no one remotely in the pipeline, should Worilds leave.  That leaves Woodley and JJones, with one having missed significant on-field time since he signed his second contract and the other being undersized and irrelevant his first year (despite seeing sizeable playing time). 

I guess if Worilds is retained, Woodley is gone and we're still w/o anything in the pipeline.  Worilds was once snakebitten with injuries in camp and possibly in to the regular season.  But Worilds seems to have worked his way out of that.  Woodley hasn't.

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« Reply #5 on: Mar 04, 2014 at 10:44 »

Meant to reply, given the list of LB atrocities foisted on us via the draft.  Like CB, an unserious investment.  Except of course when we've used R1 picks in the TomBert era on OLB who cannot set the edge, rather obviously, due to frame.  The Woodley situation is untenable from any angle.  Keep him and bench a R1 pick (barring a move inside, which, ugh).  Or watch him pull a hammy and gray-suit it a few weeks, again.  Or cut and eat the dead money.  A carousel of idiocy, under the aegis of "you can't have enough pass rushers," except that our pass rushers don't, you know, get to the QB.  Well, Worilds seems to have, better at LOLB, which means for absolute certainty he'll be pegged at ROLB.

One recurring pattern to the TomBert evals of LBs:  speed does not seem to factor, Timmons excepted; nor does frame, or KEI, or any manner of analytics.  Game tape appears to be the factor, along with gut feelings, flatuses, and other afflatuses (afflati?  Penso?).  However, it's like synching players 40 tapes from combine footage:  one guy may look good running it, but apples-to-apples comparisons come up lacking.  Whatever the reason, they're getting left behind at the position that is the meat and potatoes of Steelers D, historically. 

If the Steelers can't be disabused of the notion that Jarvis Jones isn't OLB, then I hope they look at Shazier at ILB.  Too many injury flags for Mosley, and Shazier has been highly productive, flies around the field, could really pop in the middle here.  Plus, Coach Dad's alma.  Haven't really dug much into late round LB from this class yet, TBH.  Probably because we've been infested with them, as you noted.
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« Reply #6 on: Mar 04, 2014 at 12:50 »

PFT says Worilds signed the transition tag, which prevents him from signing with another team.  They believe it suggests Worilds and the Steelers are closer than farther on a new deal.  It would buck the notion that the market would absolutely determine Worilds' price (the tag has done that for now, we'll see with a second contract)
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« Reply #7 on: Mar 04, 2014 at 14:06 »

Maybe I'm confused on this.

My understanding was that the transition tag gave the Steelers right of first refusal.  Per Wiki:

Quote
If another club offers a contract to a transitioned player, his original club has seven days to decide whether to match that offer or not. If the original club agrees to match, the player is forced to sign with the original club at the terms agreed to in the offer by the other club. If the original club declines to match, the player signs with the other team, and the original team is offered no compensation, as they would be if the player had received the franchise tag.

That says to me that a high roller could still swoop in, offer a big-assed front-loaded deal, and the Steelers would a) lose Worilds, b) lose the draft picks conferred by a franchise tag designation, and c) only receive the compensatory pick awarded the following season (2015).

I am seeing reports that the FO and Worilds are working on a long-term deal, so that would obviate the above concerns, but I think the reporting that merely signing the transition tag somehow means he couldn't sign with another team is incorrect.   I'll need the resident barristers to clarify though.
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« Reply #8 on: Mar 04, 2014 at 14:38 »

OK, I stand corrected.  Various sources saying that once he signed, he's off the market.

The vulnerable window was when we tagged him and he remained unsigned: could have entertained offers from other teams with the possibilities yada yada yada.

So.  What happens with Woodley.
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« Reply #9 on: Mar 04, 2014 at 15:48 »

My guess he is cut with a post-June 1 designation.

Disappointing as he was a great pick and had some good years.  Add that we don't know what we have with JJones (but he's a first round pick who will be given the nod to start next year) and it is a mess.
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